What Brake Pads To Try ?

[Guest david_l_perry]

Out yesterday late afternoon for a quick blat to try a few things and slowly getting used to them, but not completely convinced yet.

 

Pedal does not feel spongy at all, no leaks or air, and with a fair stamp it does get me stopped, but could not get it to lock up as I have been able do do so in the past. I didn't change anything on the pads/discs during the engine change, so don't see how any contaminants could have got on them, but it's possible.

 

Will give it some more time and driving before I look at changing anything else.

 

Just as a check, and to rule out possible contamination on the discs / pads, what's the best way to clean them ?

 

Ta. Dave

[Guest mower man]

Hi,

Search for brake cleaner @ Halfords (or similar), spray on the discs liberally and let it evaporate.

Note sure about reviving glazed pads - not done this myself - sounds like you can sand them from above in the thread.

I have cleaned pad ,shoes and even clutches in the last half century with moderate sucess on things as diverse as lawn mowers to 30 ton cranes ,trucks and buses ,if its only surface contamination no probs the not so common sense sense must be used .Liberal brake cleaner and wipe down with kitchen roll was the way for me with oil /brakefluid contam , 80 grit paper for glazing but wear a mask!! mick [been at it for 53 years]

[Bob Tucker]

This looks a bargain...

http://www.eurocarparts.com/ecp/p/car-accessories/car-maintenance-accessories/maintenance-fluids-and-greases/maintenance-fluids/?542770340&0&cc5_858%5Ecc5_1051%5E

[kevin the chicken]

I would have said that any standard pads should be able to lock up the wheels. After all the car will only weigh roughly half what a normal car does. I would start with a good clean and deglaze if you need to if the pedal feels ok. I have no idea what pads are on mine but in an emergency situation it's very easy to lock up especially the fronts, although I still have my servo. I think that when you change things like this which are operated almost instinctively it is sometimes hard to acclimatise but if you can't lock the wheels then it's not you, it's a mechanical problem!

[Guest Ian & Carole]

For 12 years I ran my car on standard pads and shoes and with no servo without any issues!!

 

I really think some times people "over think" things when really there is no need!!!

 

Start it drive it enjoy it!!

[Bob Tucker]

Ian (as always) is dead right.

I only changed to Mintex pads because standard pads

faded on trackdays. That Paddock Hill bend will test any brakes.

Otherwise standard ones were fine on the road.

[fry61]

Is it possible that a period of non-running has allowed the discs to rust slightly & that this is the "contamination" which is leading to poor performance?? Don't know if this is a possibility --but more driving may be the only "cure" necessary!!

[Guest david_l_perry]

Just a quick update. Had several runs out with the toy car, and although braking is ok, its not confidence inspiring pulling to a final stop......had a few bum tingling moments when trying to pull to a total stop

 

I do get a little bit of squealing on the front discs, not masses, but just a little

 

I think its going to be worth at least taking the pads out and cleaning the discs, and re seating the pads.

 

The brakes passed the MOT no problem last week so cant be a major issue....

[Grim]

I find if i am doing a lot of pootling and using engine braking rather than the pedal, that the mintex 1144 tend to glaze over a bit. Takes a fair bit of heavy stopping to return them to normal. I've stopped coasting down to roundabouts and use the brakes only, to use them a bit more.

Edited July 1, 2015 by Grim

[Big Jim]

It's not the pads and discs that's your problem, it's because the servo has been removed, you will need to exert MUCH more force to get anything like the same braking effort that a servo assisted set-up with the same master cylinder would give, I doubt you could even if you can manage that.

When I fitted the VX engine to my hood many years ago, I tried with just the Sierra master cylinder without the servo, certainly not happy, then I was recommended to try the VW Mk2 Golf master cylinder, slightly better but not fantastic, although I did use this for a good number of years until finally I'd had enough and wanted better.

I thought that, well, Westfields ran a system without a servo in some of their models and they didn't have problems, so I researched just which master cylinder they used when no servo, although I can't remember the part number of it now, it's the same one that was fitted to Morgans, and would you believe, Reliant Regals.(Both models didn't run servo's) I managed to get hold of a second-hand one, fitted a new seal kit to it, and BINGO!! excellent brakes now at long last!

don't waste your time messing with pads & discs, they're more than up to stopping a car that's only a third of the weight of the original Sierra, it's the Master cylinder that you need to change.

[Big Jim]

The Westfield master cylinder has twin feed, ie a split reservoir front / back

[Big Jim]

This site keeps telling me that I don't have permission to edit my posts, so this is additional to above!

 

The bore of the Westfield MC is 0.7" and they are hard to get hold of, they were also fitted to the mark 3 cortina (no servo) the girling part number is 74660152 (see photo)

 

 

[Guest 2b cruising]

Think of the,master,cylinder,and wheels,cylinders as a lever system.

Draw a line say two inches long. Put the fulcrum in the middle. Call the line to the left of the line the lever. Call,all to the right of the fulcrum the bar.

In the middle you would have no effort advantage as both sides of the line are the same.

However moving the fulcrum to the left,shortens the lever and lengthens the bar (handle).

If you had the fulcrum at 1/2" from the left edge of the line (lever). your bar would be 11/2 " from the right end of the line (bar).

This would give you an advantage of 3 to 1.

It's the same with hydraulics. Call the master cylinder the lever end and the wheel cylinders the bar. The smaller the master cylinder (lever) the graiter the advantage = the less effort required.

Or the other way around. The larger the wheel cylinder, the longer the lever bar is, less effort again.

Wheel cylinders cannot be replaced without massive engineering mods but master cylinder change is easy to do.

Another way to get the same effect is to actually alter the mechanical length of the bar and lever by moving the fulcrum point. As in the picture above, although the cylinder is similar to the Sierra, the bore is much smaller.

Edited July 1, 2015 by 2b cruising

[fry61]

Fitted Ford Ka master cylinder during build -- both Mo & I can lock up the front wheels -- might have something to do with the smaller section tyres but is fine for our car which is probably heavier than most 2B's.

[Guest david_l_perry]

I picked up Ford KA mater cylinder to try out, but in the end opted for a complete separate pedal box assembly with new master cylinders from compbrake

 

It was one of these units.

http://www.compbrake.com/product/universal-top-mounted-hydraulic-pedal-box-kit-sportline-3-pedal-ap-cylinders-kit/

 

Pedal ratio is 5:1,

cylinder size

0.625 Front

0.7 Rear

0.7 clutch

 

Had to adjust things to get it to fit of course