Best choice of engine

[theduck]

From memory it was the rods that I was always led to believe were the weak point.  They can be prone to big end bearings going too, which iirc is because they are sensitive to oil levels in the sump and also can have issues with the oil pressure  relief valve

[brumster]

Maybe. Probably all revs-related. If you're happy to keep the limit sensible, assuming you don't need the revs to chase the numbers.

I should probably clarify, I'm only talking naturally aspirated here - you turbo nutters, I know what you're like

[Guest Matt]

18 hours ago, theduck said:

Duratec needs a different gearbox to the St170/Zetec/Pinto.  Duratec may be newer than zetec, but they are a lot more hassle to fit.  They are simple enough to get to about 200, but above that they need uprated bottom end.

A car setup with a 1.8 zetec already would be a reasonably straight forward swap to an st170, but then the st170 has VVT and needs a suitable ecu, so you would need to confirm that the one in there is suitable or be willing to swap ecu.

Is there any particular reason you are set on an MK and a Duratec?
 

I dont want to throw £1000's at a pinto just to sruggle to get close to 200bhp.

From what ive seen a decent ported head with cams cam be £1000 alone. Then carbs on top of that

St170 with bike carbs and a me100 will be £1000 ish 

[theduck]

Wasnt questioning why remove a pinto, I totally get that.  Though you can get 200bhp for under a grand if you do it right!  NA tuning of a pinto is a mugs game and that is the only option are considering when they say it will costs thousands for very little power.  You can efi convert and turbocharge a pinto for well under a grand if you are careful, and easily for less than cost of bike carbs and an FR32 which seems to be the defacto tuning recommendations for a pinto these days.  For the kind of money some people spend on getting 160bhp NA on a pinto I have at least 275bhp from my pinto!  I say at least because we had wheel spin on the dyno and so couldnt get an accurate final figure for the low boost setup.  High boost will be significantly more.

Anyway I am waffling on about pintos, what I really meant was why must it be an MK rather than one of the many other seven type kits? and why a duratec rather than a decent spec zetec?  You could find a decent zetec powered car GBS Zero, Tiger, MK, Locost, MNR, etc much easier than just looking for a Duratec MK which is likely to be very rare.

As for St170, which for clarity is actually a zetec event if it says duratec on the cover, it is a great option if swapping out an older engine, though imo you should spend the bit more and go for bike throttle bodies with fuel injection over the bike carbs.

[Alvin]

Hi Matt,

pretty good advice from the other guys so far. Can I ask why your after top side of 200 horses and why an MK?

I guess this comes down to money, time and how dirty you want to get your paws. Think about the time and effort in buying the car then an engine etc or do you just go in search of one already sorted? So many options of a 7 style car and endless engine choices from owners.

When I bought my Hood with a 2 litre i knew it wouldn't be the fastest thing around but I thought later on I would sort that. Either a cosworth turbo engine (would love to 4wd it!) or for ease a pinto that was already fiddled with. In terms of having a laugh it's nuts. Maybe i'm getting old and slowing down as I'm happy with the performance..

I'm pretty hands on but never looked into all this bike carb carry on... Need to get Googlin..

 

Alan.

 

[Guest Matt]

18 hours ago, theduck said:

Wasnt questioning why remove a pinto, I totally get that.  Though you can get 200bhp for under a grand if you do it right!  NA tuning of a pinto is a mugs game and that is the only option are considering when they say it will costs thousands for very little power.  You can efi convert and turbocharge a pinto for well under a grand if you are careful, and easily for less than cost of bike carbs and an FR32 which seems to be the defacto tuning recommendations for a pinto these days.  For the kind of money some people spend on getting 160bhp NA on a pinto I have at least 275bhp from my pinto!  I say at least because we had wheel spin on the dyno and so couldnt get an accurate final figure for the low boost setup.  High boost will be significantly more.

Anyway I am waffling on about pintos, what I really meant was why must it be an MK rather than one of the many other seven type kits? and why a duratec rather than a decent spec zetec?  You could find a decent zetec powered car GBS Zero, Tiger, MK, Locost, MNR, etc much easier than just looking for a Duratec MK which is likely to be very rare.

As for St170, which for clarity is actually a zetec event if it says duratec on the cover, it is a great option if swapping out an older engine, though imo you should spend the bit more and go for bike throttle bodies with fuel injection over the bike carbs.

I just wanted honest opinions on what i could achieve with a ponto. There are 2 mks on the market, one with pinto standard. The other with a 1.8 zetec on bike carbs, equal money. But the pinto car is a much nicer car. But this is why i ask. Do i get a cleaner car but standard engine, or a car that needs a tidy up but with the zetec. Dont want to make the wrong choice 

[theduck]

It comes down to what is easier for you to do, the engine swap or making the car nicer.  For me it would be the engine swap.

[Snapperpaul]

Duratec sufferers from similar issues as a Pinto bottom end, the crank is just fine for almost any power, the rods and pistons are near their limits at above 200bhp

i know many run above 200 but not many dare to go above 220 on stock internals

what has not been discussed is the rather scary cam chain crank pulley which is only held in place by 2 friction washers and the crank pulley bolt. If the rods don’t give up the chain pulley could slip.

OUCH

My next engine project is a Fiesta ST150 engine in a Fisher Fury, I have and continue to research the Duratec engine much the way I absorbed all I know about Pinto’s

Burton Performance catalog describes the issue of marginal rods and cast pistons and other sites talk about having keyways cut into the Duratec crank and chain drive pulley.

Revs usually kill rods and detonation and cylinder pressure kill pistons.

im looking at a supercharger for my Duratec and will keyway the crank in preparation 

 

[tractor]

Yes the type 9 gearbox will fit a zetec or St170 

I had the St170 on bike carbs with an ME vvt controller it was fantastic