Ford Engine Emissions

[Jonty Wild]

Hopefully this is my last question before completing my purchase of a RH 2B and it may seem a little obtuse, but honestly it is not; for a car registered in 2016 and Ford engined, what would be the difference in emission ratings (for MOT) be between a 1600cc and a 2000cc? If nobody knows but if you have a similar car, could you tell me your engine size and emission code/rating please (on V5C)? This is not about the power of the car I am buying, I am just trying to avoid any unfortunate surprises after purchase.

[nelmo]

I have a 2L engine which was a new crate engine when the car was registered in 2017. On my V5, the CO2 field is blank. On the 2 MOTs I've done so far, both testers just did a smoke test. One guy was just lazy and the other couldn't get the sensor far enough up the exhaust to get a reading.

In theory, emissions tests are done on the year of the plate, not the year it was registered; the car may be registered in 2016 but may have an age-related plate, in which case it should be tested against the emission standards of that year. 

I doubt there will be any difference between a 1.6 and a 2L.

[Jonty Wild]

Thanks for your reply and that is interesting. It appears to be very confusing! The car I am buying has just passed its MOT, so on the face of it no problem. It is a 1989/90 registration and registered in 2016. I was worried that the latter date might be crucial.

What I have found is “In service exhaust emission standards for road vehicles: 19th edition” – it would have been quicker if I had spotted the post https://www.rhocar.org/index.php?/forums/topic/50218-pinto-emissions-fail/#comment-409227

That says (abbreviated): 
Vehicles to be tested 
The following types of vehicles will be considered as first used before 1 August 1975 (Visual Test):

• All kit-cars and amateur built vehicles first used before 1 August 1998.

So if the car was registered after 1998 that this can’t apply.

Then is goes on to:
Types of test
The emissions test to which a vehicle is subject will depend upon its date of first use (i.e. date of registration or date of manufacture if used abroad before first registration in the UK) as follows:

• All passenger cars first used on or after 1 August 1995.(2)

Clarified by: “Passenger cars first used before 1 August 1995, not mentioned in the Annex and which at date of engine manufacture were incapable of passing the catalyst test will be tested to non-catalyst standards” – but that was 1993.

So the test procedure (petrol) appears to be:

1    Visual inspection at 2500rpm for 20 seconds the returned to idle and viewed for smoke. 
2    Emissions will also be checked using an approved analyser and then refers to tables of data

The Pinto (amongst others) is too old to be listed specifically, so I think it comes under “From 1/9/2 (2000) but are not included in the Annex”. In which case the following applies:

Maximum measured values at natural engine idle speed: 
Carbon monoxide (CO) = 0.3% vo
Hydrocarbon (HC)3 = No requirement
Engine idle speed (rpm) = No specific requirement but engine must not be clearly above its normal idling speed

Maximum measured values at raised engine speed and with the gearbox in neutral:
Carbon monoxide (CO) = 0.2% 
Hydrocarbon (HC) = 0.02% vol (200ppm)
Lambda2 = 1±0.03
Engine speed (rpm) = ˃2500rpm ˂3000rpm

The above assumes that the car is NOT fitted with “equipped with advanced emission control systems”.

I think that I have answered my own question and you are correct in that engine size does not matter, but it would be good to have that confirmed by others – I think I need to find a friendly MOT station to talk to!

I am coming to the belief that some MOT testers are equally confused.

Edited June 15, 2022 by Jonty Wild

[Grim]

if you're on an age related plate, it will go off the date of first use (the age of the engine), not the registration age. Typically 3.5% CO, 1200 HC.

If Q plated many places will do visual only.

[Jonty Wild]

Thanks, I guess the date will be whatever the MOT tester decides, but at leastr I can now argue the case for no more than O.3% etc. Still trying to establish whether all 205 Pinto blocks were 2000cc though.

[IanS]

All 205 blocks are 2l

all 20 blocks are 2l

all 18 blocks are 1.8L

all 16 blocks are 1.6l

all 13 blocks are 1.3l (very rare)

 

[Grim]

The date is printed on the V5, but the chances are the tester will test it as per its number plate age. The mot system should tell the tester the correct information.

All 205 blocks are 1993cc unless over bored at some point in their life.

[Bob Tucker]

My friendly MOT station has closed, so I had to go to the one that does both my regular cars. I explained what the car was when I booked it, but it was obvious that he doesnt test kitcars often, if at all. So I printed the chart from the DVSA site I linked in the other post, and the front page (It looks really official now!)
I let him look it over, he asked a few questions about the car I told him it was based on a 1985 Sierra. He didnt ask if the engine had been changed.!

And it sailed through despite being off the road for 3 years.

[Jonty Wild]

Brilliant, thank you everyone, what great community! I was pretty sure that 205s were all 2 litres, but I will have to prove it to the DVLA as the car is incorrectly registered. You'd think it would be really easy, but I have yet to find any 'official' source to confirm it, and the nearest Ford garage, which I visited yesterday, were friendly but apparently unable to help!

Apparently Google can't answer every question asked either - looking forward to a car and full membership next week.

[rthomas69]

20 hours ago, IanS said:

All 205 blocks are 2l

all 20 blocks are 2l

all 18 blocks are 1.8L

all 16 blocks are 1.6l

all 13 blocks are 1.3l (very rare)

 

Also a 202 block (again 2l)

[DUFF ROBINSON]

Up to the latest MOT in September 2023 my tester was able to over-ride the system and do the MOT on the age related number plate. The latest one, the garage's system is now on-line to the DVLA and would not allow the tester to over-ride the date shown on the screen "2008" which was the date I first registered the vehicle. I changed the engine in 2019 (and perhaps foolishly registered the change ) now the new V5, states the car must have a catalyst although it was originally shown on the V5 as an age related registration and the original V5 does not have the additional narrative of "SVA/IVA cert issued 01 10 2008 emission limit -%CO 3.5, HC 0.12" on the v5 after I registered the different engine which is actually older than the original pinto by 4 years. 

I have been told however that a simple catalyst from MAGNA FLOW will bring the emissions down.