Xe Coil On Plug

[garethbowers]

Hi, has anyone got any advice with regards to which coil on plug set i could use with the xe? Also could these be used with a wasted spark setup (ford edis)

 

Ive found some vxr ones on ebay which arnt cheap. Also found cbr600 ones which are cheap CBR600 coil / plug caps CBR 600 f2 sport Breaking 2002 on eBay (end time 03-Feb-11 18:56:39 GMT)

 

Any reason why they shouldnt work? Its in a 2b and want to ditch the coil pack and tidy the bay.

 

Regards

 

Gareth

[garethbowers]

anyone? Think this would be an easy solution

[garethbowers]

Well ive aquired some saab oil coil on plugs. Looking forward to setting them up. Should look mint!! Better than a bulky coil pack.

[Guest old_timbo]

Let us know how it goes, photos etc. Think you are breaking new ground on this one, hence no replies.

[garethbowers]

Ahh right, I've tried a few forums to be honest and not had much replies either. What I can add tho is they will work with the ford edis setup and megasquirt setup to run spark directly. Those of you running a vaux xe, the vag 1.8t COPS fit the head nicely. However since I got the Saab ones cheap enough, I'm gonna try them!!

[Guest dinger]

If you are using Megasquirt then it is possible, wouldnt of thought the edis would work as its a wasted spark setup firing only 2 coils, now you will be firing 4 coils, you'll need to know the resistance of the coils and would need a rewire of Megasquirt, Also chect there are enough coil drivers in MS,

 

Speak to Phil at extra efi, sure he will be able to help.

 

Also you may want to think about spark plug choice.

[garethbowers]

Cheers mate. i spoke to phil last week who said in one email i would need re-wiring but i forgot to tell him i was using edis. I re-emailed him but havent had a reply yet, so asking on here. I assumed that essentially the " 2 coils " were basically 4 but paired up?

 

What plugs would you suggest?

 

Also do you know if the vaux vxr has built in ignitors at all?

 

Gareth

[Guest dinger]

Ford coil packs are a single unit with 2 coils inside, Hence you have amain 12v feed and two signal/switched earths, you would now need a live for every coil (best use a seperate fused live for each coil) If the coils have three connections in the multiplug then one of them will certainly be a misfire detect,( deffo on a VAG coil)

 

The Megasquirt may only have two coil drivers inside, you could use these and still effectivly run wasted spark, but it would be better to have seperate drivers for reliability,

 

As for plugs, I would reccomend the plug designed for the coils,,, dont know much about the XE engine but would match up a saab plug with XE ones,

[garethbowers]

Right im with you mate cheers. Ive fired another email over to Phil too. Sure peeps on here will be interested :-) What do the ignitors do exactly? IM also wondering if i have the other 2 drivers fitted if i could ditch edis all together and just run the vaux crank sensor as opposed to the external pick up i have setup.. What you think?

 

Should i stick with edis? I cant remember why i went down that route in the 1st place now it's been that long

 

Gareth

Edited February 7, 2011 by garethbowers

[Guest dinger]

I'm assuming that by igniters you mean a switched siganl to fire the coil?

 

If so the Megasquirt fires the coil which gets its infomation from the crankshaft position sensor or edis unit, the CPS will only give the MS a base position to fire,

 

Although I just thought of one issue you may have, you may need a camshaft position sensor to run COP properly, Thats the only way you can fire the coils perfectly and independantly,

 

It seems alot of work just to remove the ford ignition coil,,, However if its a learning exercise aswell then hats off to you

[Guest dinger]

some people like edis and some dont,,, personally I'd throw it in the bin but thats just my opinion,

 

It would neaten everything up a bit if thats what the intended mod will acheive

[garethbowers]

To be honest i want to tidy the bay up as the HT leads look ugly and the Ford ones dont fit the xe properley . On the same note as you say its a learning curve. I am planning to continue using wasted spark so i shouldnt need the cam sensor however my engine has got one so it can be easily incorperated. Dont fancy having it re-mapped tho really.

 

I belive some COPS have built in ignitors and some dont. Its this im not 100% on?

 

Gareth

[garethbowers]

Had a reply from Phil, the guy is total star.. Always replies with the answers. I dont like asking too much tho.. So i will be ditching the edis setup and using the vx trigger etc. How does true cops work? If i used the cam sensor, what are the benefits and would i have to have my ignition re-mapped or do the tables stay the same?

 

Does the saab and vaux cops use a 5v trigger do you know?

 

I really am a complete novice when it comes to this stuff.

 

Kind Regards

 

Gareth

[Guest old_timbo]

I'm just building a MS so I can go injection on my Pinto. As standard MS only has a single ignition driver. It was designed with a conventional coil and a distributor in mind so MS replaced the points and allowed you to map your ignition. However things have moved on and you can add extra drivers.

I'm using the standard Ford VR sensor from the EDIS system with a trigger wheel on the crank pulley. I am junking the EDIS module and will be driving the Ford coil pack direct from MS. This means I need to add one more driver. So two coil outputs / 4 cylinder wasted spark. It takes a lot of reading of the websites to work out what to do. The MSExtra MS Extra site is a good place to start as it is more up-to-date and better laid out than the main MS site.

Although it is simpler to retain the EDIS module, the problem when using it is you can't have a spark cut rev limiter - cut the signal to the EDIS and it reverts to 10Deg BTDC limp home mode.

 

It looks like you can drive COP with a wasted spark in the same way. i.e. two COPs per MS ignition driver. If you have a cam signal as well you can go full sequencial spark, but you will need 4 ignition drivers in MS. Main issue as I see it is there is not much info around on the different types of COP from both the dimensional and electronic aspects so difficult to work out which ones to get. I didn't consider COP on my Pinto due to the extra expense but also because I didn't fancy the idea of the coil pack being unsupported on the end of a plug.

 

HTH

 

Tim

[garethbowers]

Cheers for the input Tim, i read the ms site a fair bit albeit doesnt make much sense lol... The COPS im looking at bolt to the cam cover so i shouldnt have any probs there..

 

Im still on a learning curve with regards to ms... Need to figure out how the vxr and saab packs are fired now. :-)