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Pinto No Joy Yet


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Help, please! I have a 2.1lt pinto, fuel injection controled via EEC IV. I can't for the life of me get it started, I've checked all connections to and from the ecu & main sensors coil, dizzy etc but no joy. I now have sparks at all plugs, I think it's a fuel problem as no sign of fuel on plugs. The fuel pump is now working as it should through the relay & ecu, I know that there is fuel up to the rail under pressure. Any suggestions would be most helpfull, perhaps the injectors are not getting signals to open, if so how do I test?. Thanks, Ian :huh:

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Buy yourself a NOID light set. Seeley do one. Handy little led device that you can wire in to the injector and see if it is getting a signal. No doubt the electronically handy could make up their own.

 

Nigel

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Have you done any 'modifying' of the loom - shortening cables etc?

 

My favourite trick was to shorten the length of the dizzy plug cable, and forget to isolate the signal shield wire afterwards :blush: This caused similar symptoms to what you're describing - i.e. fuel pump primes, engine turns over, fuel at the rail, but none being injected. I think it's something to do with the EEC IV module needing to receive a signal from the dizzy before it gives the ok to the injectors.

 

Is your TFI module plugged in?

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Have you done any 'modifying' of the loom - shortening cables etc?

 

My favourite trick was to shorten the length of the dizzy plug cable, and forget to isolate the signal shield wire afterwards :blush: This caused similar symptoms to what you're describing - i.e. fuel pump primes, engine turns over, fuel at the rail, but none being injected. I think it's something to do with the EEC IV module needing to receive a signal from the dizzy before it gives the ok to the injectors.

 

Is your TFI module plugged in?

 

Hi guys

Thanks for the replies. I have a NOID light now & after trying no lights are flashing on turning over, so does look like electrical. I have removed insulation & checked wiring, found a small break in the insulation but I think that was isolated ok under the covering, will fix this. Checked all connections back to EEC IV, all ok. That's a good suggestion Joel I will check that, it might have been modified, sorry what do you mean by isolate each terminal in the ford plug onto the dizzy is seperate, or is there something else I need to do? I have 2 EEC IV units and have tried both :huh: . Do you think the rail needs earthing? There is a tag on the dizzy, should this be earthed? The TFI is plugged in & wiring seems solid, I will check again though.

Thanks for your inputs

 

Ian

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what do you mean by isolate each terminal in the ford plug onto the dizzy is seperate,

 

Sorry Ian, should have been clearer - the middle pin on the 3-pin dizzy plug is the signal wire (from memory I think it's - (neg)pin 1, 0 pin 2, and +(pos) pin 3.

Either way, the signal wire is the middle one, and this wire should be shielded. I think the inner wire is blue/white or blue/yellow from memory, but you won't be able to see this as it should be covered with the black shield cable. Check you've not joined it anywhere along it's length without realising it's shielded - it's easy to do (or at least that's my excuse ;) )

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Remove one of the injector plugs, And with a volt meter check if you have a Positive voltage to one of the terminals in the plug (black wire) I think, Do this with

both the ignition on and during cranking.

If no voltage then check the two D shaped connectors to the rear of the fuel rail. Unplug them and check again at the terminal connected to a black wire in one of the connectors.

 

Hope this helps

Danny

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There's also some tests you can do on your dizzy if you look at this old thread http://community.rhocar.org/index.php?show...24&hl=Dizzy

 

...about the fourth post down by Grim.

 

I might be leading you on a wild goose chase with all this though, as you say you're getting a spark anyway :rolleyes: So sorry if it prooves to be a waste of time.

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I had a similar problem on mine and it turned out to be the multi (5?) pin plugs that connect the engine bay loom to the main loom. I ended up hard wiring them to be safe. You should hear the injectors 'clicking' has you crank the engine over. I only found this out when tracing the oil light cable when it wouldnt come on. B)

 

Kieran :wacko:

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I had a similar problem on mine and it turned out to be the multi (5?) pin plugs that connect the engine bay loom to the main loom. I ended up hard wiring them to be safe. You should hear the injectors 'clicking' has you crank the engine over. I only found this out when tracing the oil light cable when it wouldnt come on. B)

 

Kieran :wacko:

Hi all

Well I've now checked all things suggested and still no luck!

 

The signal wire Bl/Y from the dizzy is shielded all the way to the EEC IV except for the first 20mm from the plug, I wrapped some shielding around it just to try.

I ran through the test suggested by joel by shorting 1&2 from dizzy plug, every time i shorted I got the fuel pump on but no clicking from the injectors or NOID light, funny enough the spark from the coil HT to earth happened when I removed the wire to 1!I am getting a spark at the spark plugs.

I noticed that the battery negative conn was getting hot also during cranking.

I've removed and checked the inj harness for damage etc, this seems ok, D connectors seem ok, full continuity to inj plugs.

I think the ignition module mounting plate could do with a clean as it is oxidised, does this need to be a good earth to a panel or just does it only act as a heat sink?

Any suggestions would be a great help

Thanks for looking

Ian

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the oxidisation on the ign module shouldt make any differance as this has its own brown earth wire - I know mine came lose and gave me a miss fire at high revs - is yours well connectd ?

 

 

Steve

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the oxidisation on the ign module shouldt make any differance as this has its own brown earth wire - I know mine came lose and gave me a miss fire at high revs - is yours well connectd ?

 

 

Steve

Hi Steve, I'll check the earths again today. One thing to note, I have gathered a few earths to one good common ponit in the engine bay which I would have thought was logical, I know the Haynes wiring diagram shows different ground points & different Br cables, just a silly thought, for instance conn 40 from the EEC IV shows the brown direct to the battery - where I have gone to this common earth point. In my mind this should not make a difference but I've got to a stage where anything is possible!

 

Danny - As far as checking the injectors I have used the NOID light on cranking, no flashing. Pulled the D connectors and just made sure that every inj plug has continuity. I see what you mean, measure the voltage, if any, is there a level under which they won't operate?

 

Any other suggestions most welcome

 

Ian

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Hi Ian.

The injectors have a constant positive feed via the ignition and are switched (pulsed) on the negative side via the ECU.

A simple voltage test would determine which route you needed to take to find the fault.

i.e constant live feed or no switching from the ECU.

If you have a wiring diagram for the ECU make sure you have all the earths connected as I think from memory there are four or five.

 

Danny

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