3 Series Suspension

[Guest mikea]

Having done the grand total of 120 miles post SVA. I have a couple of questions ..

 

I know the Zeemers are likely to need changing .. but

 

1) There are lots of creaks and cracks from the front wishbones (thought this might go with use)

2) The driver's side hase already settled lower than the passenger side

3) The car is too low and two soft at the back. (Zeemers are already close to limit of adjustment).

 

I know that other have sorted these issues

 

Any advice please ....

[Longboarder]

Front suspension is nylastic bushes between penny washers on steel shafts. Lots of grease needed.

Rear suspension. If you have the zeemers mounted in the spring pans then you probably got 180lb springs from RH. I currently have 250lb springs in. Same length. These are fine for ride height and road use. I will shortly be trying 300lb, same length, to see if this will reduce roll further without going too hard for track use.

 

Nigel

[Big Jim]

Front suspension is nylastic bushes between penny washers on steel shafts. Lots of grease needed.

Rear suspension. If you have the zeemers mounted in the spring pans then you probably got 180lb springs from RH. I currently have 250lb springs in. Same length. These are fine for ride height and road use. I will shortly be trying 300lb, same length, to see if this will reduce roll further without going too hard for track use.

 

Nigel

 

WHAT!!! 250lb springs!! summat is wrong..............

 

I have 170lb, but 11" long instead of the normal 9" long, same dia though. I find them a little harse for normal roads one-up, but perfect when 2 up or on the motorway. And I'm a little bit heavier than you Nigel.

 

 

front suspension; The "Hoodie fix" was to move the pivot of the top of the shocker nearer to the main pivot by approx 1" (or so, can't remember now! ) this was still using to 180lb x 9" springs that came on the zimmers. Then it was found that if you changed the springs to 130lbs, instead of the standard RH 180's, it did the same job.

 

The problem with the mark 3 & 3A, was the suspension didn't! it was too boody hard! you need to come down in pounage not go up! and ytou need to change to tie-bars up front, (but that's another story!)

[Longboarder]

In the rear Jim. (That's not an obscene suggestion.) I run 250lb springs in the rear. Went down as far as the 130lb in the front for comfortable road use although my front suspension design is odd with the outboard shockers. With rocking arms you can alter the distance from pivot to shock mounting point ie. leverage, which varies the apparent poundage the car sees by a factor of the square of the distance moved. Very effective. Changing the mounting point of a 170lb spring from a lever at 9 inches from the pivot to 8 inches from the pivot makes it look to the car like you have swopped to a 134lb spring. Moving the bottom pivot has a much smaller effect but can make the shocker reaction more/less linear.

This is also one of the reasons why the front outboard springs on 2B wishbones are so sensitive to the lower mounting point. Too far inboard like the pics posted by MacMustang earlier this week and the car sees them as much weaker than if they were mounted further out. Thus loads of extra preload to try to get the correct ride height and a spring that starts off almost coilbound.

 

Nigel

[Big Jim]

In the rear Jim. (That's not an obscene suggestion.) I run 250lb springs in the rear.

Nigel

 

Oh I was well aware that you were talking rears Nigel when you said 250lbs, my comments were addressed at that.

 

I felt initially that the 180lb zimmerframes weren't correct, and when I bought the Spax shockers I also went up to 200lbs springs, what it did to the suspension was to loosen my fillings over every bump! I might as well have welded it all up! there was no bloody suspension!

They were far too solid, so decided to try 150lbs springs (DT let my try & return) the 150lbs were too soft, so I went for the 170lbs, which as I said, are as near perfect as I'll get. These springs are 11" to fit the Spax units, not 9" as original on the zimmers, what difference that makes to your calculations I've no idea, just that they feel right, work right, so must be right (well at least for me!)

[Longboarder]

My coil-overs mount off the lower end of the roll over bar and in to the centre of the spring-pans in the semi-trailing arms. 180 were way too soft and with the zimmers led to many buttock clenching moments if taking a biggish hit and they used to 'pump down' if I went over a series of small bumps in succession. I changed to 200 which helped but still bottomed out with two up, then 250 which I currently have on. Still perfectly comfortable and soft/medium on the road. Looking at Barkstone pics there is still too much roll when cornering. Hence the 300lb springs next and I don't expect then to be harsh on the road. Having been down to 130 on the front I have gone back via 180 to 200 and can still see plenty of movement in the fronts on the road. This is with inclined outboard shocks, not rocking-arms.

I think what this shows is probably the minor detail differences, model to model, which make copying settings across so difficult. 2B's run 300lb as standard on the rear and feel soft to me? Earlier Hoods which use the sierra shocker mounting point on the rear of the trailing arm could probably use 150 and be firm!

 

Nigel

[Guest mikea]

erm ...

 

so what does that mean I need. The front seems soft enough (just) on the move. They need lots of grease I think. The biggest issue is too frequent bottoming out at the back with two up .. If I floor it going solo then it will also bottom out over the slightest bump. I have ordered some "splitfire" rubber spring assisters from Demon Tweeks" as a temporary fix .. otherwise looks like stronger springs I assume. (200 by the looks of it .... but I am a biggish lad !)

 

Thanks for the replies

 

Mike

[Longboarder]

Sorry, rambling off into the sunset.

 

You have a series 3. The sierra trailing arms can have coilovers mounted with their bottom ends in the centres of the arms where there is a hollow for the original sierra springs or on the original sierra shocker mounts on the back edge of the trailing arms. My experience is with the centre of the springpan. Currently 250lb is excellent for the road but a little soft for track.

 

Nigel

[Guest mikea]

Mine are pan mounted .. looks like 250lbs could be the way to go then. Just wondering if there is any point in buying new springs for the zimmers .. or do I bite the bullet and replace shocks and springs. Richard at GBS is keen to sell me some .. just the cash I'm short of at the moment.

 

PS What are you going to do with your 250 springs Nigel?

 

Thanks for the info

 

Mike

[Big Jim]

My coil-overs mount off the lower end of the roll over bar and in to the centre of the spring-pans in the semi-trailing arms.

 

Nigel

Ah! there you go! that's the reason! As well as being different at the front end, yours is also different to mine at the back end!, My shockers are mounted on the back shocker mount of the trailing arm, and to a piece of flimsy angle iron on the side of the tub, that's why there's so much difference!

 

Earlier Hoods which use the sierra shocker mounting point on the rear of the trailing arm could probably use 150 and be firm!

 

As is mine, and all other mark 3's and 3A's that I've seen, the sierra series 1 was mounted similar to yours, so that makes yours the "older model"

(Got to say though, a more substantial mounting arrangement than ours! )

[Guest mikea]

Eh ??

New Three was the last monocoque .. and the only one designed to pass the SVA unmodified .. which mine did.

[Longboarder]

250lb springs have only been on a few weeks. I need to do a track day with photos before moving up to the 300lb ones which I have yet to buy. So not selling at the moment.

I bought from Merlin Motorsport. 2.25" x 12" x 250lbs. at £57.68 incl delivery.

 

Nigel

[Guest mikea]

Thanks Nigel

 

Will order from Merlin methinks .. and cancel the assisters on order at Demon Tweeks.

 

Forgive my ignorance here .. but I assume I wil be OK putting these springs on the zeemerides.

[Longboarder]

I would remove one shocker from the car, take the spring off it and check inner diameter and length. You may also find the poundage engraved on one end. Buy same size as you currently have fitted but at the new poundage.

 

Nigel

[Guest Ad_W2001]

and for god sake use a spring compressor! a friend of mine knocked himself out (and many teeth too) removing springs from his car!