Camber Wedges Fitted

[Guest Tim Norman]

The only changes I made to the other mounts was beefing up the front outer mounts so that they were held at both sides instead of just one, As for the diff mounting I put the bottom bolt of the diff in the top hole of the mounting plate. The change in angle you refer to is insignificant given it was never flush in the first place. End result is wheels that are close to perpendicular

. No sign of a jacked up hot rod. Got the flames though!

[Guest Tim Norman]

Found a better picture. At the beginning of the build. Shows the angle of the wheels.

[Guest david_l_perry]

I really don't get this....help me understand what you have done cos my brain cant follow it.....

 

 

The wheel hub backplate is bolted to the swinging arm vertical face.....it cant move unless the swinging arm moves.

 

I assume the reason most hoods have camber is due to the swinging arms being higher than on the standard sierra settup..

 

 

The swinging arm pivot points are fixed. All the arm can do is go up and down hence the joints between the diff and wheel

 

So....how does the location of the diff change the location of the wheels....????

[Guest Tim Norman]

It's easier to just try it and see for your self. The bottom arm is also connected to the diff via the de dion tube, so when the diff goes up, the de dion goes up, and hence the angle of the hub back plate changes.

 

The reason most Hoods have too much camber is due to the whole axle being mounted lower than on the Sierra. Another option is to do the mod above but use the rear subframe from 2WD Cosworth. They were designed to run lower and as such there is less camber when used in the Hood set up. I have now done this as well and now the wheels are bang on.

[Peter Bell]

Regarding the taper washer aspect I had thought of this originally but making sure the washer is in the correct orientaion and the fact the difference in angle is very slight I thought it may not make a lot of difference. Perhaps fitting an annealed copper washer under the bolt head may help slightly if you were worried. The Sierra design is of course suitable for coping with 5 people and their luggage, so quite a lot higher stress. I know of one set used on a cosworth drift car without problems.

Peter

[Guest david_l_perry]

Tim, are you calling the main tube arm that the trailing arms are connected to a de dion tube ?

 

It was a new phrase on me but every image I find is that a de dion tube is a moving arm connecting the two trailing arms separate to the trailing arm pivot points.

 

But, essentially if I understand what you have done correctly, by changing the location of how the diff is mounted to the main support tube, that tube then rotates up a little, which in turn allows the arms to drop to the more standard sierra point, so no camber ??

 

I don't see how it can be anything other than that, as the swinging arms have to drop to get rid of the camber.

 

It looks like a great solution, but one that has to be done at construction stage ?? As I didn't build my hood I don't know how its all fixed to the car, but it looks like the main tube is secured to the diff and bolted to the underside of the chassis. Don't see how it can be adjusted once it built though.

 

 

 

[Guest Tim Norman]

The de dion tube is the big bendy tube. All I did was mount the diff higher in the 2B chassis. I didn't alter how it was connected to the rest of the subframe.

[steve in stockport]

The whole sierra rear suspension set up is designed to induce camber and rear toe in as the load or weight on it increases.Don't ask me how this works because I don't know.

Because of the way the beam and diff are mounted in the 2B it is already in a position that in effect induces camber into the set up, hence the need to add wedges to correct both the camber and rear toe in.

I've had Peter's wedges on my 2B for about 5 years and 25,000 miles without any problems, just fitted and bolted up tight as most likely everybody else has done.

[Guest Tim Norman]

I give in. It worked on mine.

[Guest david_l_perry]

I can see what you did worked perfectly on yours Tim - I think I have worked it out.....

 

Here is how I understand the assembly has to work on the standard settup:-

 

The trailing arms are hinged off the main big structural Tube section (its not a De dion Tube - a De dion tube is a separate arm that connects the wheel hubs separate from the swinging arms)..

 

The arms are hinged on plan at an angle. The drum back plates are bolted to the face of the swinging arms.

 

As the swinging arm raises up, the camber increases, as the arm lowers down the camber decreases. This is just by the action of the swinging arm hinging on the fixed chassis point .

 

You could cut off the drive shafts and as long as you have not removed the shocks, the wheel location would not change at all as it is fixed with the trailing arms....the drive shafts are jointed to allow for the swinging arms to move, they cant effect the location of the drum as that is fixed to the swinging arms...You could remove the entire diff and this would not make a scrap of difference to this mechanism.

 

 

When the arm swing is set at the correct height (lets assume the standard sierra spring height) then the wheels do not show any camber. As the car banks round a corner and the arm is forced up, the camber keeps the wheel pretty much in contact with the road as it induces camber - this is all good

 

The swinging arms are levers, that are hinged from fixed points directly off the main tube......The ONLY way that the camber can be changed without shims has to be by changing the height of the swinging arms - In your case Tim I can only think that the main tube must have been installed rotated higher than the usual by the fact that the diff is fixed to the tube, and by raising the diff, the tube rotates with it. This has the same effect as dropping the arms lower...so no camber....I think

 

 

I cant see how it could anything other than this, and why I think it would be hard to change on a Hood that is built.....

 

 

Steve, I know I could bolt the drums up on an angled face and it could be fine, the issue is, when you want to remove the bolts, if the bolt has deformed to match the backplate angle, then there is high chance it could shear. Having had all 4 bolts shear (rusted and wrong spec bolts) on my last effort to carry this mod out last time, I want to remove any risk....cos damn, it turned out to be a pain to remove 4 broken studs.

 

My brain hurts now....

[Guest Tim Norman]

Sounds legit.

Now its down to your choice, good luck and if we ever meet at a show fell free to come over and have a look.

[Guest mower man]

Like Steve I have run camber plates courtesy of Big Jim for getting on for 10 years no track day action but close to 40 k miles with some spirited driving NO bolt probs at all ,if you are unsure about bolt strength new ford oem bolts are fine [they fit cossys too ]clean every thing properly and bolt up to Ford spec ,a smear of coppergrease keeps rust at bay job done noneed to re engineer the whole susp system it work on millions of Sierras !!!!!! mower man

[Guest shaggy]

_{Dave, in my old S7 and likewise in current S7 I fitted 2 3mm washers behind the hub - no probs at all. Fit the wedges you have and give Mitch a shout when it comes to tightening the bolts up - he's proper good at that :rofl:}

[megadodo]

I have just fitted mine this morning, took the hubs right off and only had to file the inner hole out a fraction on the shims to get them to sit on the lip of the hub. Once on the wheel sits nicely vertical. I gave the disc a lick of paint while they were off!

For those interested, these are the shims. They are tapered in 2 directions

This is where they go.

And this what they look like when fitted.

View from the rear

and from the front