AndyW

Dave, did you take any photos inside the bellhousing of your clutch / spigot / release bearing when you dropped your gearbox out? If your clutch is quiet and doesn't rattle, then those of us with SuperSpecs would like to see how yours is put together for when we eventually have to change ours.

I't would help if I could understand how professionally made wiring looms are put together (a Vicky Green loom in my case). Where there are multiple common wires how are they joined together? I'm trying to visualise the physical layout. For example, I have a green/red wire coming from the indicator stalk switch which goes into the central loom. Then there are 3 other green/red wires that come out of the loom in different places on the car - front left indicator, rear left indicator, and at the warning lamp in the dash. How would those 4 wires be joined in the loom? Is there some sort of master connector somewhere, or are they all soldered together in one place, or in several different places in the loom?

Helpful info, thanks K_T and everyone. Presumably much of my loom is VG as came with the kit from RHE, but I'm told the car was wired by an "auto-electrician". Let's just say I'm not impressed by the workmanship - there are many additions and alterations that have all been done in the same red, green or brown colour wires, and some wires change colour when they come out of a batch of insulation tape. Also there are masses of wires just bundled and taped up, so I'm not sure if they are used or not. And there are many odd black wires screwed to the chassis at various places around the car, more than the 3 grounds marked on the wiring plan - I want to know what piece of equipment they come from. What's confusing me is there multiple similar green and red coloured wires around the loom, but I only seem to have 2 fuses for each, so I don't know how all the wires join up. All that makes it near impossible to determine what wires are going where and what they are connected to. I've been offered loan of a tracer and tone generator, so looking forward to trying it to see if it will help me explain my wiring system.

I see there are some cheapish ones on eBay intended for phone and network cable checking. eg. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/262547785522 Just wondered how well they worked on 12v car looms and particularly if they would help me identify where ground wires go round the loom and where they come out to fix to the chassis.

Anyone used a cable tracer & tone generator for tracking wiring and continuity around a car loom? I wonder whether it's worth getting one to help me understand where all the wires go on my SuperSpec. Any recommendations for a cheap test unit?

Thanks Kerry. Interesting. I'll have to take a look at their DesignSpark package and hope it's not over complicated.

Dave, When I thought I had a TP Sensor problem on my SuperSpec, I received this info from a chap on the Rover forums... There are 3 pins/connectors on the TPS. The outer 2 give a fixed resistance and the middle one is the wiper. With the pedal not depressed and ignition off (stepper motor not energised), you'll get a low resistance between the wiper and one of the 2 outer pins, and then as you depress the pedal the resistance should increase smoothly towards that across the outer 2 pins. TPS outer pins 5.5kOhm. wiper (middle) pin to top pin at idle (~0.6kOhm). With ignition on you should get 5v on pin 1 of the TPS - yellow/purple from ECU pin 9 3rd pin should be pink/black to earth through the ECU pin 30 middle pin of the TPS should be the wiper giving variable voltage over yellow/green back to the ECU pin 8 To check cable continuity between the sensor and the ECU you will need to find those wires in the 36 pin ECU connector and test back to the sensor plug. The connector has seals in it so it is difficult to backprobe. I used a needle carefully pushed through the outer wire covering. I would also add that I had a dodgy plug on my TPS sensor. It kept coming loose or falling off as the metal U spring clip was missing. Made myself a new clip to hold it in properly. Also cleaned up all the contacts with switch cleaner spray as it is prone to suffer from poor contacts. Cheers, Andy

Dave, the 3 wires to the Rover TPS should be: yellow/green - sensor wipe to ECU pin 8 yellow/purple - +5v supply from ECU pin 9 pink/black - earth return to ECU pin 30 (although my notes are confused and 8&9 could be the other way round) Andy

Thanks Peter and MrD. More programs to consider, although I think any CAD program and their learning curve will be overkill for my needs.

Yes I have Gimp as well but like you I have never managed to get to grips with it. Interestingly, from trawling around today I've come across Dia drawing tool http://dia-installer.de/ which has several object templates available for drawing electrical circuits. Looks good but no specific shapes for car schematics though which is a pity. Also I haven't found a way to rotate shapes or add extra connection points so it's a bit restrictive. Several programs to play around with now and see which I prefer or work best.

Ah, I'd forgotten OpenOffice had a drawing module. That looks promising, and your examples look good. I've got an old MS Office installed but found that Powerpoint wouldn't do what I want. So will have to try OO. One question - do your wiring lines connect to the switch shapes? So if you move one of the shapes do all the attached lines move with it? Think that's a lot more than I need with all the 3d modelling and surface rendering. And rather expensive to buy after the free 90 day period - 195 Euro! Great - I have Excel so will give that a try. It probably won't do layers, but I can live without that if I can just make shapes and attached lines. Thanks for the suggestions.

Can anyone recommend some PC software for creating wiring diagrams? As I work my round the electrics on my Super Spec, understanding how the previous owner put the wiring together and making changes and additions myself, I want to get everything drawn up properly showing the wire colours, connections and routing. At the moment I'm collecting loads of scraps of paper with hand-drawn diagrams. I've got the original RHE wall chart wiring diagram, but that really isn't adequate to show what goes where and a lot is missed off. Features I'm looking for are: vector drawing connector lines for wires that attach to symbols and move with them symbols for car electrical components with connector attachment points (battery, switches, fuses, relays, connectors, sensors, bulbs, etc) text annotation drawing layers would be a bonus outputs to print, jpg and pdf freeware, open source, (or cheap) Anyone use anything already that might suit?

No Al. We know that isn't the case as the graphics and the word OFF are the correct way round

Ed - yes we now think they are a variant of Rover 200 stalks, but opposite way round with lights on right and wipers on left.

A bit delayed while I've been looking at other issues, but I've now found the missing part of my loom that should go to the wiper motor. Took the tunnel cover off and found the 5 unused wires tied up next to the gear lever. Along with the flasher and hazard relays. So I can now progress with wiring up the switch.

Forget the beer for now - get it running first Good to hear the missing MAP vacuum pipe was part of the problem, but I'm running out of suggestions for why it just dies after a few mins. Check that all the other sensors are connected to the engine wiring loom - crank, coolant, knock, inlet etc as per the MEMS manual Al referred to. I know what you mean about taking on someone else's build. I bought a completed car and had no previous mechanical experience so it's a big learning curve to find out how things work or are put together. Just keep asking questions.

Just a thought, but is the vacuum pipe connected to the ECU? There should be a small dia vacuum tube running from the rear end of the inlet manifold to a small inlet pipe on the side of the MEMS unit below the wiring connector. This drives the Manifold Absolute Pressure (MAP) sensor inside the ECU. The engine won't run at all well if this sensor is not working. Check this is connected at both ends, and is not blocked with residue or the rubber perished or leaking. Be careful when attaching the hose - the inlet stub on the ECU is fragile.

Btw practice on a non-visible part first. If you damage the shiny surface of the stainless steel it's impossible to get it back.

This old forum posting has some suggestions for removing uv baked panel covering. I've not tried any but would be interest to know if any work. http://www.rhocar.org/index.php?showtopic=20464

Dave - On mine, the red & yellow fuel lines come through the tunnel and connect into 5/16" green fuel hoses under the throttle body. - red from fuel tank goes to IN on a large metal fuel filter can. Mine is mounted vertically on the end of the pedal box, but I've seen others mounted horizontally on the side chassis rail. - another green hose goes from filter OUT to the end of the fuel rail at the back of the engine under the plenum chamber and behind the inlet manifold. - on the front engine end of the fuel rail is the pressure regulator. The bottom outlet on this connects with another green fuel hose pipe that returns to the yellow pipe under the throttle and then back to fuel tank. As Al says, everyone's bulkhead seems to be different depending on how the builder arranged everything. Everything on mine is mounted on the engine side of the bulkhead. From driver's side across I have - brake servo, brake fluid reservoir, ECU, coolant expansion tank, & coil. Some relays and the fuses are also mounted around my coil, with the battery on a tray in front, but others have all the electrics under the scuttle in the passenger footwell. In terms of cooling hoses the system as designed by RHE is a bit of a bodge. Essentially the pipework looks as in this photo, although every one is different! http://car-us.com/img/source/big/161348627999_4.jpg - thermostat large outlet to top right radiator inlet using large 90 & 270 deg hoses and steel/ali pipe across the top of the rad. - front bottom left radiator outlet into large 90 deg hose up and into long steel/ali pipe along side of chassis rail then large 180 deg U hose down into water pump inlet. - thermostat rear outlet has medium hose to metal water rail under exhaust manifold. This would normally go to the heater but if you don't have one it goes with more medium dia hose to a tee piece above the starter and then hose comes up into bottom of expansion tank through steel panel. - thermostat small top front outlet goes via small hose / small bore copper pipe / small hose into the top side inlet on the expansion tank. - small outlet at left side of radiator connects to the lower side outlet on the expansion tank. Goes via a small hose along the left chassis rail. - small outlet in centre top of radiator goes via a stainless or copper 15mm pipe across the top of the engine and down to join the tee with the water rail above the starter. You should have some sort of filller/air bleed valve in this pipe as it's the highest point of the system. Having described the RHE setup I think it's fair to say that many people have had problems with this system with slow warm-up, air locks and over cooling. Al and I have ongoing discussions about how best to redesign the coolant system. We think the water is always circulating through the radiator and expansion bottle all the time, as there is no heater return into the pump which would normally be used for quick warm-up. As Al says - find your nearest Superspec and go and take photos. Andy

I agree with Al and Wanderer. There's no real need to change the engine. The Rover T16 2litre dohc is plenty powerful for the car with 136 bhp and nicely torquey with 136 lb ft. It may be 20 years old (even older if you consider the design history), but it works nicely, is relatively simple compared to modern engines, and is easy to work on. My engine has only got 3K miles on it so it's hardly even run in yet. (I have had to rebuild the head and valves due cambelt snapping, but that's a long story - see other threads!)

Looks like it's not just my car then, I should have known nothing is normal on these cars. :-) Although my 20mm difference is double what others are seeing. For chassis and suspension mountings I would have expected tighter manufacturing tolerances, but maybe it was a case of "about there" when the brackets were welded on. I did wonder if the tilt might be a design feature to compensate for the driver's weight. Or is that over-thinking it :-) Al - yes mine are mounted in holes 1 & 3. But you have Zimmers still, whereas I have Gaz, so maybe our shocks are different lengths. I've got rather too much air in my rear arches so I'd like to mount them lower and/or wind the rear springs down a bit. But I don't want to affect my front sump clearance too much as that's already minimal.

Can I ask other Superspec owners if they could have a look at their cars for me - I'd like to know if my car is different and has a problem or whether all Superspecs are like this by 'design'. Looking from the back of my car, the right driver's side is about 2cm higher than the left, so it has a bit of a tilt. I've checked the Sierra subframe and the lower coilover mountings are all OK, and the number of turns of the spring hangers is the same both sides. The difference seems to come from where the top of the coilovers are mounted onto the chassis tube. This is the left hand side: And this is the right: As can be seen there is a 2cm difference in the distance between the horizontal chassis tube and the bottom of the shock bracket. The bracket is welded in a different place on the right compared to the left. And more of the bracket can be seen. Is this normal? Or do I need to correct it to get the car level? I guess I could use the next pair of mounting holes in the righthand bracket to bring the body down a bit. Andy

Right. I've had another quick look but I can't see any obvious stray wires that should go to the wiper motor. So it's probably best that I spend some time tracing and identifying every bit of loom in my tunnel in detail and looking for any wires that are unused or tucked away. If not I'll have to make a new motor link. Thanks for everyone's hints. AndyW

Steve, thanks I've got most of that info from my own SSpec wiring diagram, but your extra annotations are useful. Sorry for being a bit thick, but the bit I don't understand is the wiring to the wiper motor. In your 2nd scan it's marked with * and has 3 wires. Where is this part of the loom on the car? Where does it come out of the main loom? I can wire up the 6 wires in the multi-plug connector to the wiper switch OK, but I don't understand how this gets back to the wiper motor itself. AndyW