Ignitionn Timing

[Guest martynr]

Can any one please advise as to what the ignition timing should be on a 2.0 pinto injection with an FR34 fast road cam.

Fitted the cam today but irresponsibly moved the auxillary drive and screwed up the ignition timing when replacing the timing belt. the valve timing is fine but i have set the ignition timing by eye. I have it running but wondered if any one knows the correct ignition timing as i know that am likely to be a few degrees out now.

regards

Martyn

[Guest chris brown]

First question what injection system have you fitted?

If it is the Sierra Bosch L-Jetronic then I'm afraid you are on to a hiding to nothing as it won’t supply at a rate to make any difference and may even be worse as it is about at max with a standard cam.

But start with the ignition at around 10 degrees then advance it up a degree or so at a time driving it at each increment to check it isn’t pinking. When you find the pinking point drop it back 2 degrees and that should be fine. virtually every engine is different the Ford recommended of 12 degrees guarantees it wont pink but mine is best at 16 degrees

[Guest martynr]

I would need to look but i do believe it is the Bosch system. Becuase the origional cam was rattling so badly i needed to replace it anyway. hopefully when the financial director agrees to release some more funds the head is to be replaced, the injection system binned and carbs fitted. my initial problem however is of my own doing. So i am greatful for the advice on the timing.

[speedtripledan]

Mine has the bosch orange cap dizzy standard it should be 8deg (haynes) now mine is changed to run bike carbs and using a bestek bosch dizzy and ecu it is running 12deg all set up on the dyno to give max results.

The only problem you have with the standard dizzy is the advance curve will be less suitable for a tuned engine my standard setup went 12 to 40 or 8 to 36 deg the more you move it up static the higher the max advance becomes where as the modified one goes 12 to 34 deg.

 

Didn,t gain any power just torque in the mid range with the ignition change

[Guest martynr]

all sorted, thanks for the info. set it up at 14btdc, running sweet and significantly less rattly than the old cam. time to move onto the next project. getting the steering wheel from out my crutch. looks like the drawnings on Colin Ushers build site will be the way to go.

[Jez Morton]

Hi Martyn,

I was thinking about upgrading my cam to the FR34 "sports injection" as it is supposed to give more power with standard injection system. I would be interested to know how it drives and if there is a noticable gain in power. Did you buy a full cam kit or just a cam and what was the cost.

 

Cheers

Jez

[peter_m7uk]

Can any one please advise as to what the ignition timing should be on a 2.0 pinto injection with an FR34 fast road cam.

Fitted the cam today but irresponsibly moved the auxillary drive and screwed up the ignition timing when replacing the timing belt. the valve timing is fine but i have set the ignition timing by eye. I have it running but wondered if any one knows the correct ignition timing as i know that am likely to be a few degrees out now.

regards

Martyn

 

Hi Martyn,

 

Do you mean FR33 Fast Road, or FR34 Sports Injection, as there seems to be a mix-up?? I have an FR34 in my 2.0EFi Pinto set to standard spark timing figures, but am yet to finish and drive the car, so I don't know how it will perform. Although, I'm pretty sure that the FR34 has the same valve timing figures as a standard cam, the only difference is that there's more lift...

I may be wrong, but if the valve timing figures are standard, I think the ignition timing will stay standard, which is 8degrees for a 2.0EFi. Would be interested to hear otherwise....

 

Pete

[baj25]

Dave Andrews' 'bible' says about 38-40deg all in (but some people use less e.g.35), tickover between 10 and 20deg, max advance coming in at about 3500rpm. Max advance is more important setting, as different dizzys have slightly different amounts of total advance, so advance at idle might be different. HTH, brian

[Guest martynr]

Hi Martyn,

I was thinking about upgrading my cam to the FR34 "sports injection" as it is supposed to give more power with standard injection system. I would be interested to know how it drives and if there is a noticable gain in power. Did you buy a full cam kit or just a cam and what was the cost.

 

Cheers

Jez

i was advised by Burton Power that the only alternative to a standard cam was the FR34K. it is a complete kit. it comeswith new valve springs, adjusters, cam, cam lube and oil seals. Given the excesive wear on the old cam the performance has clearly improved. it feels as if it has more mid range torque but i do not think it has added much in the way of overall performance. saying this however i haven't really given the car much of a run out due to the weather. In terms of cost it came in at £249.00 with postage from Burton Power but via ebay (it worked out cheaper than buying directly!!!). Having read several postings if it is performance you are looking for then clearly the injection is the issue. It appears to me that carbs in any form on an injection head gives you more options on a cam and in turn a significant performance upgrade. i feel i was a little hasty in jumping in and looking for a quick fix and the hope of something better. That said i did need a new a cam becuase the noise from the old one was an embarrasment. i would suggest giving careful consideration before buying. hope this helps.

 

all the best

Martyn

[Guest martynr]

Hi Martyn,

 

Do you mean FR33 Fast Road, or FR34 Sports Injection, as there seems to be a mix-up?? I have an FR34 in my 2.0EFi Pinto set to standard spark timing figures, but am yet to finish and drive the car, so I don't know how it will perform. Although, I'm pretty sure that the FR34 has the same valve timing figures as a standard cam, the only difference is that there's more lift...

I may be wrong, but if the valve timing figures are standard, I think the ignition timing will stay standard, which is 8degrees for a 2.0EFi. Would be interested to hear otherwise....

 

Pete

you are correct it is a sports injection cam. from the posts i have recieved and the advise from Burton the ignition timing is different than standard. i eventually set it to 14 degress BTDC as recommended by Burton Power for the cam. This seems to be ok burt will have a better feel once the snow eventually goes and i get a chance to put a few miles on the clock.

hope this helps

[speedtripledan]

To give a ball park power figure for a cam there is a car on here somewhere with the exact same same set up as mine except the addition of a cam he gained 7bhp over mine

[Guest Alan_builder]

Sorry gents you are wrong, wrong, wrong.

 

The power comes from the petrol burnt, the explosion. Injection and carbs on the same engine can feed the same petrol /air mixture, the air is set by the engine mechanics not the carb or ECU. However carbs are simpler, basic and only work well over a small environmental range. A full blown ECU with sensors for each parameter will work over all the variables. That's why they are fitted and forgotten! If you want to play each weekend fit a set of carbs. Ok that is a bit strong. Not to may people fully understand injection and that is why you say the wrong things about it. You can change the cam and get the most from the cam but not using MR Ford's ECU, get a full blown one not a toy.

 

How many times have you heard carb engines not starting on a cold morning, my point exactly.

 

 

I my

[speedtripledan]

Sorry gents you are wrong, wrong, wrong.

 

The power comes from the petrol burnt, the explosion. Injection and carbs on the same engine can feed the same petrol /air mixture, the air is set by the engine mechanics not the carb or ECU. However carbs are simpler, basic and only work well over a small environmental range. A full blown ECU with sensors for each parameter will work over all the variables. That's why they are fitted and forgotten! If you want to play each weekend fit a set of carbs. Ok that is a bit strong. Not to may people fully understand injection and that is why you say the wrong things about it. You can change the cam and get the most from the cam but not using MR Ford's ECU, get a full blown one not a toy.

 

How many times have you heard carb engines not starting on a cold morning, my point exactly.

 

 

I my

Sorry i have to disagree on relic like a pinto a well set up carb system and ecu is better, modern multi valves i agree emerald etc My bike carb former EFI pinto starts better has more power and torque then it ever did with with the standard EFI and it has better fuel consumption. It drives really well also.

Standard engines have always been produced to be a compromise that suits all climates, fuel grades and regulations so minor mods can and do improve things Modern engines you chip older engines you alter mechanicals