Indicators/hazard Warning Lights.

[Guest Brian T]

Got a few problems with electrics and they are all relating to lighting issues, the basic ones I suppose should be easy to sort out, Fog lights, reversing light etc.

 

The thing that is bugging me is none of my indicators work, whichever mode they're in ! Nothing not a glimmer.

 

Are they on the same fuse? I've checked the fuses and all are OK, wondering if perhaps one is missing? Do the operate on the same relay? Can't find that full stop ! Is the Sierra fuse box a square one? If it is, on mine there is 3 relays 2 large brown ones and one smaller black one ,is that the flasher relay? I seem to remember someone saying the hazard relay is different to the flasher relay and seperate. That was why I wondered if perhaps they have a common fuse? Anybody know what size it should be, the lowest amp fuse was 10 so checked all those, the rest are 20s and 30s I assume they are rated too high.

[philshelton]

are you running led indicator lights?

[richardm6994]

I'm probably teaching you to suck eggs.....but starting with the basics.......

 

The best way to tell which are the standard relays and which is the flasher relay is that the flaser will have the numbers 49, 49a, 31 & C at each of the pins whereas a standard relay will have 85, 86, 87 & 31 at each of the pins.

 

Generally the flasher relay is the same shape and size (maybe a bit bigger) than a standard relay

 

Firstly, check that you have 12v at pin 49 on you flasher relay. If you do, the it's not a fuse problem and probably a bust flasher. There is only 1 fuse to the indicators and also the hazards are fed from the same flasher relay.

 

Full indicator wiring diagram;

 

http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/gallery/a463727-Ford%20Indicator%20Wiring.jpg

[Guest outtolunch]

The ford indicator switches are notorious for failing, I've had indicators/dip fail once and the lights/wiper fail 3 times in 4 years. Look for any signs of melting around the pins on the switch and use a test meter to check for continuity.

[Guest Brian T]

Hi , sorry for the slow reply, had to go out last night. Thanks for the replies. I am running standard (non LED) indicators. Thanks also for the info regarding the stalk switches, didn't know they were prone to being problematic. The wiring diagram ,great, have been looking for one of these

I'll get out there later and have a good look at all the points mentioned, start with a meter at 49 I think.

 

Thanks again guys, much appreciated.

[Longboarder]

Good diagram from Richard. Power for the indicators is the ignition live going in to pin 54 on the column switch. This comes straight out again at 49 and goes to 49 on the flasher relay. As long as the ignition is switched on there should be power at 49. This passes through the relay and out at 49A and back to 49A on the column switch. So all this so far is connected up and primed with potentially pulsing lectric just bursting to find a way back to the negative on the battery and only the ignition switch has so far been moved.

The final stage is switching of the indicator stalk on the column to left or right. This connects internally in the column switch all this lectric which is sitting in 49A to either L or R and it pulses out through the indicator circuit on one side of the car, through the bulbs to earth and back to the battery.

The hazards work in much the same way using the same relay. But they must work with ignition on or off so when the hazard switch is pressed it changes over the supply to 49 in the switch from 54 ign live to 30 constant live. It also joins together 49A, L and R inside the switch which makes complete circuit. Lectric flows into the column switch at terminal 30, out at 49 to 49 on the relay, back to the switch 49A and out at both R and L through both sides of indicator bulbs to earth.

Knowing the above I hope you can now trouble shoot the indicators and hazards.

Incidentally the ford indicator relay usually only has pins in 49, out 49A and earth 31. The dash indicator light takes a feed off both left and right indicator circuits.

 

Nigel

[Guest Brian T]

Thank you very much Nigel,makes even more sense now.

 

Would you happen to know if the relay is usually mounted in the Sierra fuse box? I'm assuming it is the one off the donor, a square"ish" one. Mine is under the dash so easy to get to and has 3 relays, if not I'll have a mooch around elsewhere, is there generally a "recommended" mounting area i.e; dash area ,or is it just fit it in where you can?

[richardm6994]

From memory, the flasher unit is mounted on the sierra fuse box.

 

I've just completed (a couple of weekends ago) a total strip-out of all my original wiring (which came from the Sierra) and started from scratch by making my own loom, fusebox & relay box etc...... Believe it or not, this was so much easier than I thought it was going to be and I'm dead please with the results.

 

The indicators caused me no end of problems as I was trying to figure out the connections myself using a multimeter...........after searching the web I came across that diagram...and problem solved striaght away!

 

Good luck

[Guest Brian T]

^{Everything else seems to be fine apart from a few odds and ends which seem to go nowhere and do nothing, had a look through the "Vehicle wiring products" catalogue and it wouldn't cost a fortune to replace the loom, they do a modular fuse relay box, looks very neat and a good price, would be better than the fuse box in at the moment, half the maxi blade fuse holders are empty anyway.}

 

^{If I replace the lot and label as I go along for future reference it may make life easier .}

 

^{At a guess it would be less than £200 for the whole lot, good price and worth doing or leave well alone?}

[richardm6994]

You'd have plenty of change from £200! And it will save loads of time "fault finding" in the future should those notorious gremlins start messing up your electrics!

 

It took me a total of 4 (full) weekends to complete from start to finish. I'm mechanically minded, electrics have never been my cup of tea however I decided to go for it (you'll never learn unless you try is my moto!) and as such I stripped every last peice of wire out of the car (engine bay, dash, rear boot area, headlights .....I mean absolutly everything!) and started from scratch working my way from the ignition key.

 

I'm far from an expert, but from my recent experiences, my tips would be as follows;

 

1) Every wire joint is to be soldered and then insulated with heat shrink. Don't use insulation tape!

 

2) Use fully insulated female spade connectors when joining onto gauges etc.....

 

3) Have two 12-way fuse boxes and power one of them up from the ignition. This serves as a handy 12v fused source to switches, gauges etc.....

 

4) I used 5 relays in total; a) power-up one of the fuse boxes..... elec fan......c) starter.........d) main beam.........e) dipped beam

 

5) Root all earth's to the same point on the body.

 

6) Unless you are really good........don't try and wire up multiple items at one time as this only leads to confusion!

[Guest Brian T]

Hmmm, may have a different system to the one on the diagram and the "word picture" kindly supplied by Nigel. The relay has only 3 pins it is a 19FL Flasher 012933 it has 49a 49+ and 31- connections. When I took the relay off a terminal was rusty so I cleaned that off and now the hazard warning light control light comes on steady red, no flashing anywhere, hazards or indicators, no "Click " coming from the relay either, I'm wondering if possibly this is an older type wiring layout and there is maybe also a flasher unit in there as well somewhere? Had a look for one none found up to now, I'm looking for a small cylindrical aluminium item, that was the last type I remember seeing, 2 connectors IIRC.

 

As for the other lighting problems , fog lights sorted , reversing light sorted, dipped beam NSF sorted. All that is needed for MOT is steering rack gaiter replacing, the seats replacing (bolting down) and the harnesses refitting, on that point is there usually specific easily identifiable "Strongpoints" where they should be fitted, there are a few bolts in the "tunnel" but no witness marks to indicate a fitting has been on there for any period of time, I'm assuming the rear harness is bolted through on the roll bar fitting. I'm guessing they have to be in an easily accessable place so you can check them and the MOT tester can ensure integrity so not tucked away down the side. Got use of a 2 post ramp for a few hours later this week so hopefully will get them done soon.

 

Off to trawl the web and see if I can find a wiring diagram for that type of relay.

[Longboarder]

No need to trawl. The wiring diagram is as given by richard except there is no C wire off the relay to run the dash indicator light. The way it works remains as was described in my spiel. I did say a three contact flasher was usual. You sound as if you have identified a possible corrosion problem in the fuse/relay box. All contacts need to be spotless before you go any further and that might just solve your problem. Substituting a known good flasher relay might be worth a try after you have cleaned all the contacts.

 

Nigel

[Guest Brian T]

Thanks Nigel I reread your original reply just after I posted above and popped out and got a new relay, I got an electronic rather than a bi-metal that way if a change to led indicators happens at anytime that will cope with it. I'll try it tomorrow and post the result. Thanks again.

[Longboarder]

Just noticed you are in Newton Abbott. I was there two weeks ago buying a tintop. I could pop up at a suitable time to have a look if you don't get it sorted.

 

Nigel

[Guest Brian T]

Thanks for the offer Nigel ,much appreciated. Going to pop over later ,hopefully , and try the new relay and see if that cures it.

 

Hopefully we'll meet up sometime in the next few months, can't be many Hoodies down this way.