Tie Bars / Compression Struts

[cb750]

Another day and another problem! When I took the tie bars off my 3A during this rebuild the rose joints mounted on the body bracket OK but the track control arm rubbers were badly twisted in the arm. I have now rebuilt the front suspension with all new ball joints, TCAs, and rack. Come to refit the tie bars and the rose joints want to locate further out from the body (about 95mm) unless you force them over to the original location and this then pulls the TCAs outer rubber bush out of line and twists the TCAs on the inner bush. Anyone else have this problem? I will be redesigning the mounting brackets anyway but making them stick out further will look a bit weird!

 

Rally Design and Burton Power sell compression struts with a clevis arrangement near the tca end to allow for repositioning the tie bar rod at different angles to the body, has anyone used these?

 

Rob

[Snapperpaul]

Mine were only a couple of cm out so pushing them on to the bracket was easy

No real distortion of the bush but certainly under tension

[biksz]

mine was same as pauls just a few cm out just pushed against them a little then they were fitted.pic would help.

[Peter Bell]

Hi Rob the staight bars are sometime under a bit of stress but yours seem to be a bit excessive! they tend be be pulled in a bit to prevent the wheels rubbing on full lock. What length are your tie bars from ctr of rose joint to the step where the bush starts?

[cb750]

I will post a photo tomorrow plus measurement

[cb750]

Couldn't post yesterday, I went to my eye specialist for a check up and came out worse than I went in - blinding headache and couldn't focus on anything until late. OK now though so here goes:

 

Posted 2 pics showing the problem and the type of bush in the TCA. The old rose joint is fitted in these photos.

 

Length of rod from the step to the rose joint centre is approx 31.5 cm, (12 1/2 inch). Had a look at the old TCA bushes, these are the conical type and they were badly distorted and worn oval due, I suspect the excessive twist on the tie bar. My new TCAs have the pressed in bushes as shown on one of the pics. These are really firm and resist movement quite a lot such that when you push sideways on the tie rod it pushes the TCA straight out of alignment and loads up the inner bush.

 

Spoke to Rally Design about there compression strut kits but the length is too great (any reinforcing box section would foul the sump. Also you remove the TCA bushes and bolt the swivel joint straight into the TCA. This might be OK for competion work but I would have thought it feed any bump right into the body.

 

Next step is to get to the stage where I can fit the wheel and see where it fouls

 

Rob

 

[Guest shaggy]

Just been tom the motor factors, and they were on about this type of bush. In the Eighties, they used to sell millions of this type of bush in the photo cos they were crap.

Have you replaced like for like, or are the new bushes you have are they the thicker rubber bushes? If they are the new thicker rubber type, then you should find a bit more movement in them than the old pressed steel bushes.

Si

[cb750]

Simon, the bushes are what were fitted in the new track control arms. I have 2 sets of new TCAs and both have these type of bushes. I also have a genuine Ford TCA and this has the same bush. My main problem is that with either type of bush the tie bar is going to have to be forced out of line to meet the bracket (I'm replacing the crap piece of steel angle anyway but I need to get the new fabrication right!)

[biksz]

mower man has got a set of plans which i used and found very good but he is away i will see if i can copy them at work and if you pm me your address i will send you them if you want.

[cb750]

Thanks but I have the plans from mowerman and the rods are identical to the rods that are fitted to mine except my rosejoints are 1/2 UNF. I think either that my rosejoint location point must be too close to the body (I can correct that when I alter the current mounting to a better one) or that I have to accept that the rods have to be forced out of line for now.

[Snapperpaul]

My TCA bushes are the ones with large washers and rubber top hats, Standard Suerra stuff

 

 

 

As you can see the rosé joint end is only a cm or 2 out

 

You do have Sierra TCA's not Escort?

And if Sierra are they on the right sides?

 

Looking at your photos again I'm thinking your compression struts are to short

 

My body mounts are close to the engine mounts meaning the rear most bolt is inside the tower, I cut out a section so I could get a nut on

Edited March 14, 2013 by Snapperpaul

[richardm6994]

This may be worth a read if you've not already...

 

http://www.rhocar.org/index.php?showtopic=32640&hl=%20tie%20%20bars&st=0

 

[Peter Bell]

Here is a useful link to the old Dave Andrews site, loads of information on there.

http://www.s262612653.websitehome.co.uk/DVAndrews/tiebar.htm

 

You will need the other style of TCA bushes though Rob the ones you have are pretty poor I remember them well from my days of owning Sierras.

[biksz]

or just change the bushes for the poly ones bit more expensive but worth it from people say i have not done it yet butr intend to when they need changing.

[cb750]

Paul, I thought they were too short as well but they match mower man and the Andrews site drawings (272mm from the end to the step at the tca plus about 40mm for the rose joint). The TCAs are brand new sierra ones fitted the right way round, the rubber bushes are what were supplied pressed into place by the manufacturer. There seems to be 2 types of bush being used and I have the crap ones!

 

One of the previous owners had fitted the bars to brackets which were bolted to the sides of the car without any reinforcing, the sides started to push in so he or she took them off and replaced them with the steel angle that is currently fitted. This is going to come off and be replaced with a system similar to yours. The holes for the original brackets are still there and the rear one is just in line with the engine mounting tower.

 

Poly bushes are a good upgrade, I put them all round on my Triumph Stag and they improved the handling no end! Problem with doing this to this car at the moment is that it will make it even more difficult to force the tie bar over to meet its mounting point. A plus point would be that it gets rid of the suspect bushes, I was thinking they may have been moulded off-centre.

 

Rob